SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hope you are holding up okay. This stuff is so difficult. Self care!

I’m ok, I really am. I feel at peace. My wife and I went to church yesterday and on the drive a song came on that brought up some emotion and tears. If I was alone, I could have had a nice cry, but I didn’t want to break down in front of her. I let out a few tears and took deep breaths and met the moment. She tried to put her hand on my arm and comfort me, but I didn’t really find it comforting. My deep sadness is the only emotion she seems capable to be in the presence of, and that just isn’t good enough for a marriage partner, I’ve got way more emotions than that. So if that is all she can handle, she doesn’t get even that.

My deep sadness is the only emotion she seems capable to be in the presence of, and that just isn’t good enough for a marriage partner, I’ve got way more emotions than that. So if that is all she can handle, she doesn’t get even that.

This is the death knell of a marriage. You start closing yourself off because you don't see any point to opening up. Eventually, you will disconnect to the point where you won't feel anything (or feel very little) for her.

She's losing you, InkHulk. And the tragic thing is that by the time she realizes this-- if she ever does-- you will already be gone.

Inkhulk
Sorry for your ongoing struggles. Some people are just not capable of connecting on a deep and meaningful way. My IC would say those folks have a"series of interactions" instead of a "relationship." It sounds like your wife is one of those people. As much as she may want to, she just might not have the capacity to connect in a way you need from a life partner. But I do believe that people can change if they really want to. I guess that’s what the Bible calls repentance. . Turning away from our old ways and becoming someone we were always meant to be. I am sorry that you are hurting and disappointed by the lack of progress in your R. Maybe taking a break from your marriage might be helpful. Possibly a legal separation?

Put less politely if you asked me, my words would be 'Good Riddance!'

You aren’t going to ever catch me saying that. But we can all agree that I’m not rugsweeping, right?

For him, not for me

Man Inkhulk, I'm sorry you're in the throes of dealing with this. It's crazy-making business. I don't know if this is helpful, but maybe it's beneficial to you to dissect the above statement:

"For him"

I think that HikingOut provided a great explanation for how it's quite possible that Mrs. InkHulk did little more than squat for him. About as much care that you might have for the person you hand your money over to when you're buying a new shirt that makes you look so fabulous.

"Not for me"

This is the hard part. I'm glad to hear that you plan on taking some alone time to figure that out. What is indeed for you? I know it's complicated, especially when it comes to sex. But she needs to be meeting you at the discussion table. Even though you are both working on your own shit. You can't decide on how to move forward without knowing what your working with. Sometimes a work in progress is sufficient...sometimes not.

I think the sex stuff related to betrayal is especially confusing.

- Would it have been okay if they WANTED to have sex with another person but couldn’t pull it off (all these articles make it sound like EVERYBODY at some point is attracted to sex with another despite marriage)
- Is it somehow less painful if the sex was just to get ego kibbles (this seems only to apply to women because the assumption is men definitely will want to have sex with virtually anyone—no ego kibbles required)
- Is the worst part the connection that is inevitably created by physical intimacy, even if they previously didn’t feel connected to them? Is this all just down to Oxytocin?
- What does all this say about their sexual interest in you? Is that a real problem or just something that is a natural part of having repetitive physical intimacy with the same person for decades? Like is the difference between the evil WS and the angelic BS just that the BS was willing to tolerate the natural mild boredom that arises from sex with the same person forever. Or that the BS would have liked to cheat but was just simply afraid of the fallout.
- Am I supposed to be mad that my spouse was tempted to do this or just that they did it?

Plus it seems almost uniformly like the men on this site just don’t really get how women think about sex. We are constantly bombarded with all kinds of expectations that we are supposed to live up to with men, how we are supposed to sexually satisfy them if they are our partner, or just make them feel appealing even if they aren’t our partner. Must be nice when you turn them down. Its an obligation of sorts that is so hardwired by the time adulthood rolls around I would be hard pressed to figure out what the point of what I have done sexually was whether I was a female WS or female BS.

To make matters worse, here we have this site that is supposed to help us understand what the heck happened and is happening and we aren’t even allowed to discuss really that there are some pretty consistent differences between how men and women think about sex.

And all that would be fine and understandable but I hate to think of some male BSes being tortured by thoughts about the A sex that may be completely inaccurate and could be cleared up if they were allowed to discuss this stuff openly. (Regardless of whether they choose to stay in or leave the marriage, which seems like an entirely separate issue)

The truth is, I’ve kept the "for him, not for me" element out of circulation here because I really don’t want to talk about it. I followed AspectNorth’s thread a few months back to get the gist of what I’d hear here. I made up my own mind from that and how I feel about it and I really really don’t want to talk about that.

I can tell you one thing marriage definitely is not:
It’s the attitude that a spouse is disposable simply because there are other potential spouses available.

some male BSes being tortured by thoughts about the A sex that may be completely inaccurate and could be cleared up if they were allowed to discuss this stuff openly

And who exactly is enforcing this ‘censorship’? Only the mods have that power. Which of the forum’s policies do they site for blocking any discussion of what women ‘truly think’ about sex?

Surely you have some examples where the block/banhammer came out for some women who attempted to write about sex. Could you share some?

[This message edited by gr8ful at 2:15 PM, Tuesday, January 23rd]

I definitely have no examples. Just a vague understanding that one of the rules was something like we are not supposed to say things like "men tend to think this way…whereas women tend to think this way…."

That kind of thing. I thought that wasn’t allowed, but maybe it is. I only have a pretty fuzzy understanding of what the rules actually are

** Posting as a mod, but speaking for myself, not for other mods **

...we aren’t even allowed to discuss really that there are some pretty consistent differences between how men and women think about sex.

No generalizing, for crying out loud. That's the guideline that has to be protected.

Posting about one's thoughts and feelings about one's own and one's partner's sexuality is very definitely permitted.

Personally, I might be open to letting a bona fide expert draw generalizations in their area of expertise, but no one on SI has presented any such credentials in the area of sex.

And all that would be fine and understandable but I hate to think of some male BSes being tortured by thoughts about the A sex that may be completely inaccurate and could be cleared up if they were allowed to discuss this stuff openly. (Regardless of whether they choose to stay in or leave the marriage, which seems like an entirely separate issue)

The only A sex that matters to me is my W's. This site allows, enables, and even encourages discussing one thoughts and feelings about that.

Speculating about what may be in the minds of people when they think about sex doesn't help me one bit, and I don't think such speculation helps any BS. I'd wager the primary 'help' it offers is distancing oneself from the reality.

Discussing MY thoughts and feelings and actually asking my W about her A sex - those were BIG aids in my recovery. Given what people post about discussions they have with their partners, I'd bet a lot that sticking with one's own thoughts and feelings and asking one's own WS about their experience helps virtually every BS.

*****

And who exactly is enforcing this ‘censorship’? Only the mods have that power.

That's a total misunderstanding of how a community works.

We have guidelines. Members of the community agree to follow the guidelines for the benefit of all. Mods do their best to take action only when guidelines are violated.

Before I was a staff member I felt the mods' lash a few times. I survived, obviously. I reread the guidelines each time and resolved to follow them more closely.

****

And one of the guidelines is, IIRC, if you have a problem with an action of a mod, don't complain publicly - take it up with the mods.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:02 PM, Tuesday, January 23rd]

https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums/guidelines/

Marriage is for me, a relationship where you have each other's back and where you trust each other. Marriage is also a place where you share gifts with each other that you do not share with anyone else.

An affair ruins the trust part, yes that is obvious. The trust, however, is not simply whether or not that your partner will never cheat again but also...now you have these nagging questions about your partner's loyalty and trustworthiness that you didn't have before. And related, if you R, as to WHY your partner wants to R. Getting to InkHulk specifically, your WW has a lot of compelling plausible reasons to R that don't have much to do with how she feels about you as a man. Can that trust be rebuilt? I have no idea but I truly feel that *censored myself I'm gonna try this again this time staying on the right side of the rules* it is...very difficult and I am having a tough time seeing why anyone would want to try.

Now, let's talk about the sharing gifts with others. Let's be blunt here: A BH who recovers has to accept that fact that another man saw his wife naked and that alone is extremely difficult for many to get past. Now, if your partner happen to do things with their AP that they didn't do with you--sexually, or say, they took their AP on a trip to Europe and you have been dreaming to go--that makes it exponentially harder to recover.

Anyway, I tell @InkHulk about all the women out there better than his WW, NOT because one is entitled in a marriage to look for the bigger better deal (of course one is **not** entitled), but instead because I think deep down InkHulk is afraid that should he divorce his wife, the rest of his life would be miserable. I think he would instead find a huge weight lifted off his shoulders.

[This message edited by WontBeFooledAgai at 8:44 PM, Wednesday, January 24th]

My deep sadness is the only emotion she seems capable to be in the presence of, and that just isn’t good enough for a marriage partner, I’ve got way more emotions than that.

This is interesting to me and strikes me as important. Why do you think this is? Does she agree (or are you even able to have that conversation with her)? If so, what are her thoughts on this?

I apologize to everyone, especially to InkHulk, for bringing up a sensitive topic. Ink, I hope that you do have an outlet to discuss this as it sounds like a major hurdle in your attempt to R.

Marriage to me is a lot of things, but a biggie is being able to communicate candidly, and without fear, about any and all problems that are affecting it. And with that, I will honor your request to drop the subject matter.

I apologize to everyone, especially to InkHulk, for bringing up a sensitive topic. Ink, I hope that you do have an outlet to discuss this as it sounds like a major hurdle in your attempt to R.

No apology needed. You and others responded to something I wrote and now you are respecting my wishes that I’ve since made known. I can’t ask for better than that.

Miss you, HF, hope you are ok.

Hi Ink, I was wondering how IHS was going for you. I also wanted to know if you and your wife have talked about her rejecting doing things for you that she did for AP is a slap in the face. I dont think a woman should be obligated to do anything they dont want to do, but I just wonder if she realizes the impact that it has when she was supposed to be committed to you. I remember a post in the wayward forum last year about a woman who did things with her AP that she claims she couldnt do with her husband because he was "too big." His argument was that she gave more to someone who couldnt commit to her than the person who loved her. I feel that was a profound statement. I am lucky in the sense that my ex wife did not do anything we had not done together. While I have had less partners, the sex acts I have taken part in prior to her are alot more adventurous.
I just wanted to ask that and see how you were doing. Also wondered if you thought more on getting that tattoo you talked about. My daughter and I are talking about getting matching tattoos. She wants me to go first though so she can back out if it looks painful.
How is your wife handling IHS? does she appear to be using her time effectively?

Hi Ink, I was wondering how IHS was going for you.

Do you mean IFS (Internal Family Systems), ie parts work?

I also wanted to know if you and your wife have talked about her rejecting doing things for you that she did for AP is a slap in the face.

I’m going to assume that you missed my request to not talk about this topic. I’m going to reiterate though; I have excellent clarity about where I personally stand on this, it also causes me significant discomfort to think about it, and there fore I am not going to talk about it here. Thank you everyone for respecting that. I understand if there are misses, I’m not calling anyone out, just being crystal clear. I mentioned it even at all in response to BTB’s question about how I took such a hard turn, that is what explains it, and from there I want to let it lay.

I’m terribly sorry Ink. I guess I missed that. My ADHD must be acting up. I skim a lot.
Sorry to have broached the subject. I hope things are going well though.